HOW TO SELL ANY SERVICE TO ANYONE | The System Saad Used to Build a ₹50 Crore Service Business

0:00You have 6 months to make as much money as possible. What are you doing? I'm going to find a sales job. Everything always goes back to sales, [music] no matter what. To get to a million dollars is very easy. You need 20 people to pay you $4,000 for 12 months and it's a million

0:15dollars. People lost their minds.

0:22We should do this again and do part two. You know, the next time I'm going to actually walk you through the entire sales call where I will show you what my three gates of hell are. This was the masterpiece from Saad. This is a banger podcast. You have to watch this. 1 [music] 2 3 and start. This is episode two with Saad. What are you here to

0:46teach me? Sales is the easiest job in the [music] world and the most I have to cuss for this, the most rewarding. How to build a sales engine to generate sales worth 50 crores? There are three main components that come into [music] making a sale, okay? One is your offer. Offer is pretty much what you sell, your distribution, who you sell to, and sales, how you sell to

1:09them. So, a lot of people are like, "Organic kar rahe ho, leads aana hai." Nahi. Bro, what are you saying? Organic, no paid. 6.8 million. [laughter] Help me land a client who'd pay me $1 million. Yeah, hard transfer. [music] My card? I'm sending you a link right now. Right now? Let me think about those two

1:27models and get back to you. Can I tell you something? I will [music] give you 1,000 dirhams which is a refundable deposit. This will actually put you in a state of putting some thought [music] into it. Yeah, let's do that. Awesome. I've received your payment. Deep discovery, I call it the gates of hell, has three gates of hell. The first thing is need. Second is decision-making and timeline gate. You pass this gate, you then go to the third gate. This is where most sales people doubt. They're

1:51going to hate that I said this. How do you think I can keep track of all the leads from all my streams? This is a game-changer that most people overlook. [music] Very, very, very like if they just do this, revenue will skyrocket.

2:09Okay, guys. This is episode 2 with Sad, and this time Sad is here to teach us something very, very exciting. Sad, what are you here to teach me? Basically, the idea is two years within two years. The last year we did 50 crores in revenue in a service business that sells only two things. And everything that it takes to actually sell or get to this point where you can get to that mark, I'm going to show it to you without you actually

2:31having to think about all the mistakes. So, the next 2 hours is trying to figure out how do you go from I have no idea what I'm supposed to be selling to I am able to build a service business with one or two offers that can get to 50 crores a year. Cuz that's what we use. Okay. Sad, first let's do macro, and let's figure out the first principles of sales. Understand the system very well, and then I want to go micro to understand the architecture of a call

2:57Okay. that can help me land a client who'd pay me $1 million. Okay, awesome. So, basically, one of the most common mistakes that people have is they're trying to fix sales where it's not a sales problem. It's a full funnel problem. So, first we need to understand what do you need in order for you to actually make a sale. There are three There are three main components that come into making a sale, okay? One is your offer. Offer is pretty much what you sell, your distribution, who you sell to, and sales, how you sell to them. So, one of the most common things that keep happening in

3:33India is the burden's on the salesperson to be able to generate revenue and not on the rest of the ecosystem that needs to support it. Yeah. Like if a company is not making revenue, the first people that get fired are sales people. But this is the last component of the three. If your first two are not operating at the level that needs to operate on, the third cannot. A great salesman with a mediocre distribution, mediocre offer can do well. Oh, because but that's all he can do. He can drive. So, most founder led

4:04sales happen when these both are broken. But the moment they have a sales organization, it doesn't work anymore. Purely because your offer is not right and your distribution is not right. What do you mean by that? Can you give me an example? Have you seen a smaller agencies where the founder is able to make sales, but he's unable to go from the founder to making sales to actually sales people

4:23making sales? Yeah. That's because the offer and the distributions are [ __ ] Can you give me an example of what is an offer and what is distribution? Offer has seven components. Okay, I'm going to walk you through all of the seven components. This is called as an offer stack. Offer stack. Okay. Offer stack. So, number one is getting specific. Like for example, the statement sound like this, "We will help

4:44you grow your business." What does that mean? Right? So, when you speak to people who have crossed a million dollars in revenue, you'll start noticing they're going to tell you very specific outlines. "We will help you get to 20 leads a month for the money you're going to pay me." Unless you're being very specific about the dream outcome, your offer is broken. So, most people who are not able to sell, the sales people sales team is not able to sell purely because they don't have the

5:14conviction of the founder. When you don't have the conviction of the founder and most agencies basically are selling to people they meet randomly and not really through a funnel. Right? Not really through a sales system or system where you're able to predictably tell how many leads are coming in or how many are closing, it is happening because the founder is driving it

5:33through pure conviction. Correct. And the moment it goes to like oh, now that I'm making X amount of money, which does happen with with great founder led sales, it does happen. But the moment they have to translate it, they are not able to deliver it because the founder is selling through conviction. The salesperson will never have it. So, one of the things first things that somebody if you have an offer is ask yourself is the out dream outcome that you're promising is it vague or is it as specific? So, I'll give you an example of vague sounds looks like this. We help D2C brands

6:06scale. scale. Matlab kya hai dost? Like you get what I'm saying? Versus we take You can go as specific as possible. You can speak to a specific D2C brand but for now I'll keep it as D2C brands go from 50 crores to 250 crores using X methodology. It's a hyper specific thing that you need to offer that can directly

6:29relate to their dream outcome. Everyone who's coming for a service has a dream outcome. If we are unable to capture that dream outcome, our offer is weak. And the methodology is also very very important. Yes, everything stems to method methodology because if you don't have a methodology, you're not unique enough. You're going to be compared at price points with everybody. This is one of the things you know yesterday I put out a video I'm digressing and I said to get

6:53to a million dollars is very easy. And it's honestly not that hard because you just need to get somebody to pay you $4,000. You need 20 people to pay you $4,000 for 12 months and it's a million dollars. So, it's like you're not getting to 100 you don't have to struggle to get to 100 clients, 200 clients. You need to get to 20 people who are willing to pay you $4,000. People lost their minds. Chaar hazaar mein kya bechega tu? Khud ko bech raha hai kya? And I'm there [laughter]

7:21Standard Instagram comment. Yeah, and I'm like How [snorts] do I explain $4,000 is not even high ticket? Like you get what I'm saying? So, unless you get to this hyper specific dream outcome, you'll never be able to charge. If you don't have a dream outcome and if you're giving a vague outcome, you will be compared to everybody else in the market and then the problem then what happens is you're going to go into price

7:50comparison. Then whoever is the cheapest wins. Make sense? So this is a clear differentiator with having a very specific dream outcome. This is one. Okay. Two is identity identify the obstacles. So a lot of people don't do the activity of if I'm if I'm going to be selling to D2C brands. What are the five to six obstacles that they are having? So you need to have a very clear understanding of what those obstacles are because once you have an understanding of what the obstacles are, then you can track that back and make sure that that is a part of what is the value statement of the

8:27offer. But if you don't identify, so now we're being specific and our specific value statement is directly correlated to that specific outcome, sorry, specific obstacle of that particular category. So we are next into obstacles that they are facing, okay? Three is your stack of value. Stack of value is basically every single thing you can add on top of one on top of two on top

8:55of three on top of four on top of five. The reason why you're stacking this the price that they are paying has to look so small compared to what you're giving to them that it should be a no-brainer. So what is the value stack that you can do? And the value stack is directly

9:13correlated to the obstacles they have. So each of those value stacks that you're offering has to directly solve the obstacle. So you need to figure out what is everything that can stop them from achieving this particular outcome and whatever those obstacles are should be a value stack predefined by you. Understood. Okay. Third value stack. Fourth is increase in perceived likelihood of success. So, increased in perceived likelihood of success basically means they need to see proof. So, your job is to take whatever their problems are, you have created a specific offer. Now, you have to show them that you can actually do this. So, you need undeniable stack

9:54of proof. You can't just make statements and not back it up. You have to have a statement and whatever that statement is has to be backed up by something that's a proof or a testimonial. And the higher this stack is, the higher the likelihood of success they can believe they'll have. So, you need proof. Okay? So, this is fourth one, that is

10:14the perceived likelihood of success. Okay? Fifth is reduce time and effort. I'll give you an example. Reduce time and effort for? For them. So, for example, my thing is in order for us to be How long does social media take? For most people it's like it's going to take 3 months, 6 months, 4 months. Our contract

10:36is 2 months long. If we can help you, you'll know within 2 months. If we can't help you, you'll know within 2 months. For us, the test period is six videos on a brand new page. If it works, it works in six videos. If it doesn't work, it never works. Okay? So, the time for them to see the result is extremely short. Okay? Second is we don't want you to think about anything. We'll handle everything. So, our offering contains every possible expense that can possibly happen. A lot of times agencies do what? They have a price and they have side stack prices. For example, for example, social media. They'll be

11:11like, "Okay, it's going to cost this much." And then when you actually start working with them, they're like, "Okay, model cost is this much. Location cost is this much." They will They will not disclose it in fear. We have an all-inclusive price. If it comes into this, if it ever exceeds this, we'll pay from it from our side. So, there is no effort from their side beyond this in terms of we will make sure day one this is going to happen, day two this is going to happen. All you

11:33have to do, you don't have to think. I'll give you a quick example, right? Every time a new client comes in, before we used to get them to make like simple things like Insta IDs. Now we buy a new phone, put a new SIM card, new email, we create it on their email ID and we handle everything. So the idea is once you come to us, you shouldn't be thinking about anything other than yes, no, I like, I don't like, approved, good job, result, no

12:01result. Your ability to think is reduced to zero. And I think that's a great proposition. The moment you tell the other person that you don't have to do anything, we don't want you to do anything. I think that's a great proposition. Huh. So your effort, the the prospect's effort and time. So we'll get you results. When I say results, it is a quantifiable success in a very short period of time. Instead of having waiting for 6 months to be

12:27able to see the fruit of your labor. Which creates lethargy. So time to success, whatever that you define, has to be short enough and the effort they put has to be low enough. This is five. Okay. Up to six out of 10. Reduce the risk. Now this is a bit of a double-edged sword, okay? I don't like this one. But it's a part of it which which is a very Alex Hermosi situation,

12:51which is make them a no-brainer offer. So reduce risk as in how low to zero can you take their risk? If you pay the money and if doesn't work, I'll give you a 100% refund. This is reduced risk. The problem we have learned with this is the moment you have a guarantee or a refund. Now we don't do guarantees, refunds at all. We have doubled our price without doing guarantees and refunds. At guarantees

13:14and refund our price were lower. The client stops taking the onus of actually showing up. Now as much as we can control everything, they still need to show up to a shoot. Yeah. They stop showing up because they have nothing to lose. With a guarantee in a service business is a death trap cuz they stop taking it seriously cuz they have no skin in the

13:34game. So, when you have no skin in the game, what ends up happening is what should probably take you 30 days cuz you're spent a [ __ ] ton of money to get my service, now it'll take 90 days. Cuz you don't care cuz if it doesn't work, you're going to get your money back. So, even if you do de-risk, it has to be

13:52super conditional. For example, one of the conditions if I were to ever put in a guarantee, it would be if you cancel more than two shoots, you voided your refund policy. If you do not show up to the meetings that we If you have for the 60-day contract, if you're unable to show up for more than a week, your contract is voided. So, it has to be super strict because what ends up happening is if you're not, they don't have skin in the game and they have nothing to lose. And if they have nothing to lose, anything given for free in this world is

14:26taken for granted. Right? So, there's no free meal. The moment you make it a free meal, they'll just go with the flow. So, this is a bit of a double-edged sword. I would try to reduce this risk just to zero. Depending on Depending on which stage of your business you are in. If you're just starting out, you have no proof, you have nothing, and you're just like, I just want to get my first meal,

14:50reduce the risk. Take a hit, right? Cuz you have no liabilities. But at a scale where where you're trying to do 10 million, 20 million, 30 million, that can become a liability versus it becoming a value proposition for the organization. So, here you can kind of take your own bet depending on what your

15:09offer is. We're going into seven, okay? That is add urgency and scarcity. How do you differentiate between false urgency and true urgency? Oof, that's a that's a bit tricky. Because everybody tries to create urgency. Correct. Right? Um how do you create true urgency? I'd have to think about it for a second. So, it really comes to supply and demand, right? At this point, for example, uh I have few things that have super high supply and super low supply and super high demand. There it's not very hard because I am One of the things in sales you need to understand is if you're on a sales call I'm talking about

15:46specifically on a sales call then I'll go wider. A lot of it is body language and verbal cues. If you don't believe the urgency, you can't sell the urgency. It'll come off as fake. But, for example, me, I can only take on X amount of clients per month. So, when I'm saying it, it is not an

16:05offer. It's a matter of fact. Like if you leave, I'm not afraid for you to leave. Like you should be ready to let that person not buy. So, in a sales call you should be able to say probably this is not for you. Because when you come to that position mentally in a sales call, when you say I can only take four people, I've already taken three people, I've only one slot left, I have eight more sales call, and I have a close rate of 40%. What's your

16:30decision? I'm I'm talking about numbers that are very real for me. So, it translates. Problem what ends up happening is when you start overusing urgency. So, there are brands that are perpetually on offers. Then that offer only is what? Got it. Name and price. This is one of the more important ones. Name and price. Okay. has to be unique to you because they shouldn't be able to mistake it with

16:57everybody else. Is that always possible, sir? When you actually have a method that is unique to you. For example, let's take interior design. How would you name a method for interior design? You don't make name the method. You name the process with which you you achieve an outcome. Again, it's the same, right? As an interior designer, how would you name a method that is so different from

17:20your competitor? Mhm. I mean, you can show proof, which [snorts] is great. When it comes to being specific, it's pretty clear. I will help you get this project done in 40 days at less than 30 lakh rupees. Perfect. Okay, how do you do that? How do you do what? So, how we achieve the outcome is the method. And no two people ever have the same plus two plus one two three four method. Our method is called Hyper Niche. This is what we built our entire

17:48school of thought of content on. Okay. So, for example, I would start with something like this. I wouldn't even start with the offer. I would ask you how long do you think it takes for content to work? How long does it take? For your content to work. Organic content, zero followers, new page altogether, to get to 100,000 views, a million views. How long do you think it takes for

18:06200,000 views on Instagram? Yeah, 100,000 views, a million views. Are you talking about consistent viewership? Consistent viewership. Three to four months? It takes six videos. Six videos? Okay. If it works, it works in six videos. And if it doesn't work, it's highly unlikely it'll work in that format. Can I show you? I actually disagree with that, though. I know, brilliant. That's why I want to

18:28show you. So, again, statement. So, this is called breaking belief statement. Something that the generic world believes that this is the truth. My whole thing is I'm going to show you undeniable proof of us doing it. So, it goes I know you're not going to believe it. Till I tell So, I say what's my next

18:45statement? Can I show you? Right? For example, we built this page. It has 41 posts. Okay? This is made how many weeks ago? [gasps] [laughter] I'll show you more. Wait, hold on. See from the first reel. See from the first reel. Bro, what are you saying? And I will show you another one. The first reel is 5.6 million.

19:06Huh. We have That's the whole So, if it works, it works like It's not a metric of time. This sounds unbelievable. Now, I'll show you this one. This will blow you away. This is six videos, six posts. Organic, no paid. Now, you see how I have differentiated myself from every other agency in the market. Because if you don't have a differentiation, it it just then becomes a pricing battle. Oh, he's cheaper. I'll go with him. Because most If you tell most social media people, they're selling what? Six videos, four reels,

19:41eight statics, 20,000 rupees. That's not an outcome or a method. That is deliverables by a videographer and an editor. Yeah. Understood. Now, we come to price. If you're not pricing yourself high enough, people don't take you seriously enough. So, the problem with what ends up happening is you have to proportionately increase your price. Every single time you get harder with your offer, you have to increase your price. A lot One of the biggest problems that most people have is actually increasing the price because they're scared. They're scared for one of two reasons. Number one, their constant

20:14thing is who will buy. Why they ask this question, who will buy, is because they would never buy. Most people never actually spend. Most agency owners are broke. Most service business owners are broke. How I went from this one to 12.5 is when I was selling it at 4,000, I would get on, say, for example, 10

20:36calls. I would see how easy it is for me to take the money. If the money is coming to me without any resistance, I'm too [ __ ] low. So, one of the easiest way to do it is out of 10 calls, if more than 50% are buying, your price is low. You increase by 25%.

20:59Okay. The reason why I'm saying you increase by 25% is the salesperson will be scared to sell it at a higher price point. You will probably need to increase it by 200% which is more the truth. But the problem is the sales person who's selling it shouldn't [ __ ] his bed saying the price. So if like for example the last few jumps that we have done, we have doubled the price. We went from 20,000 to

21:2340,000. So one of the things is sales people need to have conviction of the product and the service that they're selling. If they don't have that, it's very hard to sell. Like a lot of companies will be like, "Oh my sales people are for call." Your service is for call, buddy. Like like he what he's what you're asking him to sell, you're showing him it doesn't work cuz he can see the organization. You know one of the saddest things that people

21:48don't talk about is sales people sell. Initially when sales people come no, they sell they sell higher. Then over a period of time they actually start reducing how much they sell. It happens very commonly for one single reason. They start seeing that the promises they are making on a sales call is not being delivered by the company that is actually being there. So when that happens, they lose conviction. When they lose conviction, no script in the world

22:11can help them close better. So there are there are tangibles and there are things that are these that I it's not training. It's your if your service is [ __ ] I can't actually help you sell more. Correct. Like there are conditions for this to work. Like condition one is your actual product has to be good. Right? You have to work on your methodology and your offer and you have to have clear product outcome. If you're selling generic [ __ ] and coming here and listening to this and you're like, "Oh,

22:39I'm going to make a million dollars." That's not how it works. Got it. Right? So you increase it by 25% 25% increments. The more confident you get, you go from 25% to 50%. You keep doing this up until you get to a point where you are at a 30% close rate. Now at a 30% close rate, you then still need to ask two

23:00questions. Is it 30% closed because your skill is low. Now, that means your sales person has to develop his skill. He needs to get better at selling. Or the skill of the sales person is great. People who are buying it are great. The ones who are not buying So, for example, now comes the statement what I made. If somebody is not buying from me today in Dubai, it is not because they don't believe it works. It's because they

23:27can't afford it. So, the 30% close rate purely comes from the fact of affordability. Got it. This is how you reach the price mode. Now, what ends up happening is now you need a bigger distribution, a better distribution. Now, it comes into the game of Now that you have an offer, how do you crack the pockets of

23:44distribution? Got it. So, this is the part one, which is offer, which is be very specific, identify the obstacles, have your stack of value to help the client with the obstacles, increase in perceived likelihood of success, which is through proof, reduce time and effort, reduce risk, add urgency, but don't fake it. And then name your methodology and

24:06price. Is that clear? Yes. [snorts] People, if you're running a sales team and you're using spreadsheets, you are making a big, big mistake. Sheets is a terrible idea because with a 5% sales team, there is no way to verify your data input and the entire system works with no proof, no history, and no timestamp. And most CRMs don't work because either they are complicated or they do not integrate well with existing systems. That is exactly where Odoo

24:30comes in. Odoo is not a standalone CRM. In just one system, it can handle your CRM, your quotations, your invoicing, inventory, email, and even payment. So, when your team closes a deal, the quote, the invoice, the delivery, all of it just happens with no retyping, no leakage, and no hopping between tools. And you can get all of this for free. Yes, you can get the first Odoo app for free and the full suite for just 580 rupees per user per month. So, if you want to make your sales team hyper efficient, sign up for Odoo CRM today using the link in the description. And just like last time, I am attaching a

25:07full-fledged workbook in the description so that you don't just listen, but actually apply the lessons that you learn from this podcast. Okay, let's go to distribution. Now comes the second part, which is distribution. Okay. So, distribution may there are two components, widely divided into organic distribution and paid distribution. Now, couple of things you need to keep in mind when it comes to distribution is

25:28distribution is not just let me run ads. One of the most common mistakes people do for lead generation is they start running ads from, for example, I have an Instagram page. Okay? I start running ads on this. This Instagram page doesn't have [ __ ] Okay? I run an ad, so people always validate who this is. If the brand is unknown, which means if you don't have organic activity, you have low trust. So, what happens when you have low trust? You are

26:00getting leads. The cost per lead is high. That is problem statement number one. Problem statement number two is even if your cost per lead is high, they're coming to the sales call and your sales cycle becomes longer. Which means that you're going to spend a lot more time, lot more money for the same amount of people. For example, I

26:22what we did is we built organic first. So, first you need to build some sort of a presence. Which can validate trust. So, organic does trust building activity. That means if somebody sees you, you're real, you're tangible, somebody they can trust. If you are some random brand page with just generic [ __ ] generic posters and just brand pics that doesn't look like anything, people don't trust that. So, what I would what would cost me, say for example, 20 AED, that's 20 dirhams per lead when I run ads, my competition without any kind of organic presence cost them 200 dirhams. So, first is the cost per lead is super

27:05high. Why does it cost 200 dirhams? It's a very simple thing. If you've seen me before in my organic presence, and I show you my ad, I need to show you my ad once or twice. But, if you haven't seen me, I would have to show you my ads 10 to 15 times for you to sign up. So, the cost it takes for me to get somebody on board is far more expensive when I do

27:23not have organic sorted out. So, a lot of people are like, "Organic leads on a night." There's a place for organic. There's a place for ads. It's always accumulation of the two or a variation It's It's a balance of the two that will allow you to actually scale. Right? So, I'm very big on ads. I'm very big on Even though I don't sell it as a service, I I'm known for cold calling. If somebody would ask me, I would say, "Build your organic Do cold calling if you have no money. Like, you're [ __ ] I'm just I'm just starting my business. Cold calling is the easiest way for you to

27:56get into any doors." As you're doing it, start working on your organic content because this is where your trust is being developed. If you get decently sized here, decently sized is anywhere between 50 to 100,000 followers, you have some level of organic trust, you can then start running ads, your cost per lead will go

28:12down, you can stop doing cold calling. And I promise you, if you start doing I'll ads well, and today ads are so easy because Meta's AI pretty much knows like you can have a crane in the background and it'll send it to construction workers. Like, that's how accurate. And it's mostly creative centered versus um your targeting now. So, it's not

28:32really your targeting in your Meta suit. It's literally what does your creative say? Like, if you If I show you my ad sets Can I show you my ad sets for a second? Sure. Can we show it to the audience as well? Yeah. Yeah, I can show you. No, the reason why I'm showing this is for you

28:44to know like it's not overcomplicated. It has to be This is the ad sets that we are running right now. So, these are the statics. Now, you'll see how hyper how basic and hyper specific these statics are. It's literally a back background with written words. These give me the best leads today. Really? Amazing balls leads. These are like simple

29:10The most static pages. Static pages. But, read what's what's written. Yeah, yeah. It is super specific who we are talking to. So, every static will tell exactly who we are speaking to. This is amazing. So, anybody can do it like from tomorrow. Like If you are a let me read it out. So, this is what it looks like. It's a black with white. If you're a founder {slash} CEO of a real estate brokerage tired of losing millions of dollars listing to competitors with better social presence, we want to make

29:36you viral on social media HOS. That's it. Basically, it follows the offer stack and being very specific. It's being super specific. And with meta, you don't have to do targeting cuz as long as you're specific with the words that you're using, it'll show it to the founder. It'll show it to the founder real estate brokerage owner. We go like if your company is making $50,000

29:58and want to get to $25,000. And this is your problem and this is your solution. Fill out the form below. And it shows it to those people. Amazing. So, that's the that's why your offer. If you don't fix your offer, you can't get to your distribution properly. Even if you do end up getting distribution and your offer is weak, people don't know what you're selling and you're generic

30:17and it's useless. Got it. Right? So, first is organic, then is you have paid ads. In paid ads, just make sure that you have organic distribution because then it's it costs you lower plus because the trust activity. Now, for example, when somebody gets on a call with me, Sarth, they've seen me for the last 9 months. So, trust building is the activity has

30:37been happening for the last 9 months. So, So they get on a call with me, they close. But now they have no idea who you are, they get on a call with you, you have no organic presence, you're brand new. The trust is so low that what should what would take me 1 day to close is taking you 4 months to close. So your sales

30:54process has now become super long. Yeah. So this is where brand uh lead generation, ads, organic. So the higher the brand, so here's what it is. The bigger the brand the easier to sell. The lower the skill you require in sales. So depending on which is more powerful, the other can be a little weaker. And your brand presence is strong, your landing page also if it's weak, it

31:21doesn't matter. Yeah. So your landing page is basically what a sales person. We are glorified checkout pages. That take 10%. [laughter] Right? So depending on So most people have one of the things stronger. Best companies who are able to scale to 100 million plus are people who have all three. Alex Hormozi is a great [ __ ] example of this. His offer is no-brainer always, right? His value stack. If you ever go to a masterclass of Alex Hormozi, he will tell you this is what is cost, this is what is the cost, this is what is the

31:55cost, this is what is the cost. And how much you would have to pay is this, but I'm going to give you this, this, this, this, this, this. And it's going to be this much. So it becomes like a [ __ ] no-brainer. But it's He can't just get on a masterclass and start doing this. He's been creating this offer for a very long time. He's been building presence for a very long time. Even after building presence and offer, he still needs to run ads. When he launched 100 [clears throat] million dollars, he still had to run ads, he still had to do affiliate, he still had to do all of

32:23those things. So his distribution is insanely strong. Paid, unpaid. This is where a great distribution, it doesn't matter who you are. You need to master ads. You need to do brand building activities. You need to do organic presence building activities. These three, if it becomes strong, your sales people will have a easier time. So, basically what ends up happening is you have created a brand, you've created organic presence, you have lead flow. Now, the whole thing is now a lead has entered in multiple ways, either through your IG, DM, your form on your website, and email. So,

33:01this is a mix of organic and paid. No, I have a question for you, sir. When leads come in through IG, through a form, or through an email, they're all different different sources, right? For us, it's also LinkedIn, it's also Twitter sometimes, it's also my personal DM sometimes. Now, what we usually do is we try to direct them towards a CRM. And we do that by asking them to fill a form, and

33:23that's where a lot of lead leaks. So, how do you think I can keep track of all the leads from all my streams? People are lazy, bro. They don't want to fill out forms. It might be he might have 50 lakhs.

33:39He doesn't want to do it. So, you fill it for him, no? How? How? Get on a call, keep your form up, and fill it. It's not an either-or situation, it's a and situation. You get on a call and fill out the CRM. But here, there's another challenge. Let's say there is a company with

33:58massive distribution. Now, a company with massive distribution will have high-quality leads and low-quality leads. Especially when it comes to high-ticket items, the quality of leads is bad on an average, but great in the long run. For example, let's say this company gets 700 leads. Out of these 700 leads, only 50 of them agreed. Now, 50 high-ticket leads per month is amazing, but 700 leads a month overall is very

34:27bad. Now, here's where I have a problem. If there is a sales team that needs to service all 700 leads and they have to be high quality people, that's very inefficient. How many people do you think it takes to service 700 people? I'm assuming five people. So, break it down. [sighs] So, you want to have numbers, right? So, 700 people means 700

34:54divided by 30. That is 23 leads per day. Assume you talk to all 23, which is highly impossible because not all of them will pick up the phone or respond. Assume 70% on that, 16 people. Assume you give 10 minutes to 16 people. So, into 10 minutes. That's 161 minutes. How much is that?

35:192 and 1/2 hours. That's all. And even if it's 30 minutes, it's only 8 hours at best. No, 2 and 1/2 That's a first touch point to make sure that every person who gets on reaches out to you has a 5-minute conversation, not a sales call. Getting 5 minutes of your attention. It takes

35:392 hours. It's never that long. We overextend this in our heads because we're like 700 leads. No, it is 16 people. That's amazing. Right? So, you need to be able to bring it down to the narrow one because unless you do that, you're going to have this problem. But then when you quantify this, you realize that this is just 2 hours. You realize your actual setter

36:01can probably take on three times this. Got it. And imagine their kill rate then. I was training a car team where they were catering to between 11,000 to 13,000 leads per month and it was a five people team that was talking to 11 to 13,000. My job was to get them from 5% to a 12% conversion, which was basically of the all the leads that came in 11,000 to 13,000 people 5% of them were showing up to the showroom. I basically took to 12% showing up to the showroom. Sales we didn't fix, we just fixed the first

36:37touch point. Wow. And it doubled their revenue. Amazing. Because you just increase the number of people that walks in. So you don't have to fix sales, you fix parts of the system the rest of it. But the thing is you need to become aware. So I would always suggest before you hire some random sales person do the

36:52activity. Because you'll real realize it's not really that hard. Sales is the easiest job in the world. And the most rewarding. And the most I have to curse for this the most [ __ ] rewarding one. So much money. If Here's the way I want you to look at it in from your business

37:10perspective. If your sales people are not closing ask yourself how much of it is your fault. Think about it instead of blaming the sales people. And if your sales people are closing very well, you got to ask how much of that is because of the sales people. Yes. And then when you do it know you can start tweaking it cuz then you know offer weak or a

37:34distribution say yeah. Sales people say yeah. You offer him a job market me like a or the offer we are bringing to the market that is not working. So then you stop blaming the sales people and the marketing team and you will actually sit and like what is an offer that I can create that people will actually want to buy because nobody no matter how famous you are is going to buy [ __ ] simply because

37:53they'll buy it once. Yeah. But to make it recurring as a business you know you have to [ __ ] keep delivering. Yeah. Guys before we move on with the podcast I have something very special to share with you. If you're among the top 1% sales folks who are looking out for a job that pays more than 12 lakh rupees a year, please fill the form in the description because we might get back to you with something very very special. At the same time if you're an enterprise looking out for the top 1% sales folks in the country, please fill the form in the description and we'll get back to

38:19you very very soon. Now should we hop on call? So, let let's track back a few one more thing before we kind of get into the call, okay? A few things that you need to keep in mind. So, everything in sales over a period of time becomes stats. If you do sales, for example, for 6 months and you're able to actually track all of those things, you're able to systematically understand what's your close rate, what's your show up rate, what's your lead rate, what's your open rate, stuff like that. When you do this consistently as an activity for 6 months, your next 12 months can be

38:49extrapolated based on that. Right? So, a couple of things when you when lead comes in, I'm going to talk about is you need to become aware of a couple of things. So, one is how many leads and from where. These are not people who you're speaking to. This is just inquiries. Okay? So, you're going to take your email, you're going to take your DMs, you're going to take your XYZ, whatever whatever whatever, and you're going to create a Excel, which basically you can use a CRM if you have enough of it, but the idea is you need to understand what your inquiry or lead

39:28number is. So, for example, if you are getting um 200 inquiries, that's 200 leads, for example. Now, the question is of these 200 leads, what ends up happening is most people concentrate on how many people are closing. There's a couple of things you need to do before it even comes to closing, because this is leaks. So, it's a funnel you're building, and each point is a different leak that if you fix, it'll automatically fix your revenue without

39:54you having to fix your sales people. Right? So, from lead to your first touch point. Okay? So, of the 200 people who are coming in and inquiring to work with you, how many of them are actually getting on to a meeting? So, first touch point is how How people are you actually and how much how many people are do you end up actually talking to? So out of 200 people you are probably talking to say for you in a

40:2670% of 200 is how much? Let's take Let's take numbers for example 50% which is 100 100 people. For example 100 people are people who you end up getting on a call with. This is the job of this call is to do discovery. And band. Budget authority you need this is to do qualification disqualification. This is not to do sales call. This should happen in sub 5 minutes. From the time somebody has put an inquiry to the first call going out should happen within 5

40:56minutes. This is a game changer that most people overlook. Very very very like if they just do this just get in get on a call with somebody who who reached out to you in the first 5 minutes your revenue will skyrocket. The reason why is because when somebody inquiry when somebody has an sends an inquiry this is where they are highest probability of sale happens. Now imagine I'm excited I'm like [ __ ] I saw something that you you said I'm like I

41:25want to put a placement on Think School. Now imagine you get in touch with them 2 weeks later. [snorts] They have died down the excitement. Imagine you get in touch with them 1 week later. They have 100 things have happened they have done Imagine they got excited. They like dude this is so insane I saw it they inquired and 5 minutes later you spoke to them. In that ex excitement the flow goes your probability of closing

41:47becomes higher. That's why it's important to make sure that within 5 minutes you get on a call with them. This to a meeting. Now the question is of the 200 people 100 people are getting on a call of those 100 people you qualify disqualify assume 50% that is 50 people end up on a meeting.

42:07Okay. Of these 50 people that are coming up on a meeting how many of them are closing? Say 20% of 10% are closing, which is your five closing. Now, to fix your sale, you can simply increase this 200 from 100 to 150. Automatically, this number increases without your sales call doing anything else. You can increase from 100 to 50, and this number will increase. So, you see, you don't really have to have to just fix your sales. You can just fix the funnel, and your revenue will

42:38reflect automatically. Right? And when you start tracking this at different different points, and you notice that from 200 100 people used to come, but now 50 people are coming. That means there's a leak here somewhere. What did you do in the system, or what has changed? That way you can fix that. Instead of saying sales look

43:00uh sales people are [ __ ] up. You need to find where is it leaking. It's very important to identify these things. So, number of leads that are coming in, what is the pick up rate? So, that means if somebody's filling out a form, for example, when you call them, what is the pick up rate? What is the show up rate? That means from the people who are booking the meetings, how many of them are showing up? Of the people showing up, how many of them are qualified? How many of them are unqualified? So, you'll be able to decipher. Of the people who are qualified, how many of them are actually

43:29closing? How many of them are How many of them are closing immediately? How many of them are closing 3 months from now? When you start understanding, you can go deeper, deeper, deeper, and the more deeper you can go, the more you can keep fixing those funnels. Initially, this is more than enough for you to kind of start out

43:43with. The moment you understand this, you will actually get an idea whether it's actually a offer issue, it is a distribution issue, it's an activity issue, is it a the person who is having this call issue, or the person who is having this call issue, then you'll know the reality of why this is

44:01working or not working. So, this is up until what you need to take care of before the closing call happens. Now comes Okay, now somebody got in touch with them. They got them on a meeting. Now we're getting to what happens on the meeting. The reason why I'm not going into first touch point is it's pretty much the same as the cold calling part one that we do, no? If you follow the same format, you're pretty much good

44:25with the first touch point. Okay? Because the same format really basically works. Now you've booked them into a meeting. Once you booked them into a meeting, this is entirely a sales call. We're going to break up the sales call, what is happening, why it's happening, and why each one of these components serve different purposes. The first thing that happens is our

44:46rapport. Okay? This is 2 minutes long. Rapport is extremely important because if you don't do rapport right, you're not setting the tone for the rest of the conversation. When you do rapport wrong or are very blunt or very chaotic, when you end up asking questions which will give you information, there's a wall in front of

45:03them. So, within the first 30 seconds, they've already judged you. If you're being a in the first 30 seconds, which some sales people end up becoming, imagine you need to now do discovery with them, asking them what their pain is. They're not going to [ __ ] tell you what their pain is cuz you were being a to them or you didn't do it properly or your rapport did not give them a feeling of I can actually have a conversation with

45:29this person. You get what I'm saying? This is where the premise of rapport comes. You need to segue from rapport to what we tell context. Context is what this call is about. So, for example, let's do a quick role play, right? You get on a call. I'm like, "Hey, hey, what's up? What's going

45:47on?" Hi Saad. Okay, you're very serious. I love that you're so serious. Okay, awesome. How is your day going How was your day going, by the way? It's going good. It's going good. You seem a little stressed. Everything okay? Everything is okay. Everything is okay. Awesome. Listen, before we kind of jump into everything else, I need to understand if I can help you or not. And if I can help you, I can give you what our services are. But the main thing we are trying to figure out is what is it that you're looking for, where are you coming from, what is it that you're trying to achieve? Because

46:17if it aligns, then we can have an amazing time. Does it sound fair? Yeah. Okay. In order for me to understand those things, I need to ask you a few questions. These questions help me get better context about our situation, whether we can actually help you or not. If we can, we can go in this direction. If we can't, the best thing I can do for you is connect you with somebody else who

46:35can actually help you. Sure. The reason why we give this This lot of people don't give context is they start asking questions. The prospect doesn't know why he's answering that question. That seems intrusive. Yes. But when I give context as to why I'm asking questions, the context is in order for me to find out

46:51if I can actually help you or not. I can't give you my service. So, in order for me to find that out, I need to ask you a few questions. Can I ask you those questions? Sure. their permission. Right? Once I take their permission, I start asking questions. Now, this is something that I've kind of built myself, which is there are a bunch of people who kind of do it in their own way, but the idea is you need to now go

47:12into deep discovery. This is where most sales people forget. Deep discovery has two objective. Qualify to pitch or disqualify. If they're disqualified, we don't pitch the product or the price ever. The goal is to first find out whether these are the people who can actually be your customer. Okay? Now, deep discovery, I call it the gates of

47:40hell, has three gates of hell. Okay? Your job is to walk You are the guardian. You have now died. You have to pass through these gates. You are not standing against the gate. You're guiding the prospect by asking questions so that they can pass through the gate. For example, each one of them is a

47:58qualifying point. Are these the three gates of hell? Yeah, these are the three gates of hell, okay? So, the first thing, the qualifying point is if we both are having clarity here, I can let you pass. If I don't get clarity here, I can't let you pass. For example? Now, I'm getting to it. So, the first

48:17thing is need. So, they need to qualify the need gate. That means what are you specifically looking for? Now, most people will take surface answer and walk away with it. So, for example, if I talk to a client, we're like, "Oh, what are you looking for?" "Oh, I'm looking for social media." "Oh, that's amazing. I do social media." No. Social media means 300 different things for 300 different people. That's amazing. You're looking for social media. What specifically in social media are you

48:44looking for? "Oh, we're looking for We're looking to go viral." That's amazing. Do you have any specific method you would like to go viral on? "Oh, we We want to make viral videos." Okay, that's awesome. Okay. So, just before we go in, have you tried this before? Did it work out? "No, I went to another agency. It didn't work out. They burned

49:06my money." When you say they didn't work out, what do you mean by that? "Oh, they You know, they made 10 videos. It didn't work." I'm like, "Oh, that's interesting. How much did you spend with them?" And they're like, "No, I spent like 2,000 dirhams." And now I know the problem is this guy is not spending. So, unless you ask enough questions, you'll never know. Because a lot of times what happens is a client comes and like, "I need leads." And I'm like,

49:34"Yeah, great. That's awesome, right?" And you're like, "My other agency [ __ ] me. So, uh you Can you help me get leads?" Now, the question becomes what does leads mean for him? How much leads are enough leads? Is uh Did the other agency [ __ ] up did this guy not allow them to succeed? What do most sales people do? Yeah, bro, those

49:57people are the problem. But, the thing is this guy, if he was problematic there, he's going to continue to be problematic here unless I do two things. I either align him, educate him, or disqualify him. If there is no clarity. Yes. Okay. If we are not on the same page, I will try to realign him. There's no going through the gate unless we are absolutely sure that the need that you're specifically looking for is a

50:23service I provide. At the price at which you provide. Price is secondary. Okay. So, in the first gate of hell, the purpose is to establish need specific need and price sensitivity. No, no, no. Just need. Okay. But, then when you ask the question on how much did they spend with the previous agency? That is just for me to gauge what their

50:41understanding of need is. Shouldn't we always gauge that? We do it later. He's not come to gate three yet. Got it. So, the first gate of hell is clarity and clarity only and that too about need. What is the specific need? What is the specific outcome? What have What are they trying to achieve with us? Is what they believe. Like, for example, somebody will come to me like, "Can you make me go viral?" Amazing. Like, "Okay,

51:01that's going to give me leads." Oh. Hold up, buddy. Virality doesn't translate to leads. That's a whole different conversation. So, need is aligned, outcome is not aligned. Now, I have to [ __ ] realign him cuz if I move him past, he will be a pain. So, either I have to align him, or I have to educate him, or I have to disqualify him. If he's like really unable to get my point, there is no

51:28conversation about budget. Budget is later. Can I actually help you? Do you understand what I'm going to try to do for you? If those two things are not aligned, what who what matters, what's the timeline, what's the budget, what's anything? And people brush over need like it's nobody's business. You need to ask at least three layers of why do you believe

51:58that. When you say why do you believe that, does that mean why do you believe that you need the service? Why do you Yeah. Like when they when I ask them for example, why like if I'm like, "Okay, I need viral content." Oh, why why do you need you believe viral content? Oh, because that is going to make me famous. Why why I just want to understand because I want to make sure

52:20we get through. Is there any specific reason you want to become famous? To make more money. Amazing. I love that. Do you have Do you know what that more money looks like? Maybe another 50 crores. You need another Where are you at right now? Zero. Zero. Okay, and how long do you need to take How long are you hoping to work with us to get to that 50 crores from

52:43zero? 3 years. 3 years. Amazing. Do you have any specific Look, this is by the way 3 years. Okay, how much now he has and you are sure that you want to do organic content? Yes. Okay, amazing. So, this is aligned. Aligned? This is aligned. Okay, but isn't this too wild? 50 crores in 3 years?

53:01Yeah. For a person who's at zero? No, I started this 2 years ago and I have My whole thing is I only sell a system that I can do myself. Whatever I'm talking about right now. let's say couldn't deliver on this, let's say I say 5,000 crores. Uh-huh. Then you would have to then you would

53:17have to let me go. no, but then I still wouldn't say no to him. I would ask, "Why do you think you can get to 5,000 crores?" Because there's something I'm missing. Ah, got it. I'm So, nothing is wild. Nothing is wild. Because that guy might have a factory that he must have built that can make 5,000 crores. He just never started selling it. I don't know. So, we call it [ __ ] curiosity. You have to be so dumb about everything. You have to just

53:42keep asking why. Until you are sure to a doubt without an ounce of question that what he's talking about and what we do can be aligned. If that doesn't happen, you don't pass through. Understood. So, there's nothing called absurd. We We just don't have context. We need to get context. So, you'll keep asking questions till I have context. I'll bother you till I have context. I'll ask you 100 That's why I said before I start, I'm going to ask you questions. I need to know. And if he starts getting

54:10irritated, I'll be like, "Listen, dude. You want me to help you or you want me to randomly give you something that's not going to work for you? Help you, right? How can I help you without knowing what your situation is?" Interesting. So, I will tell him like, "Dude, like how how do you want me to do this?" Like somebody's like, "Oh, you can do

54:26this in 20 minutes." Like, "No." So, it's all either aligned and if they are not aligned, no, immediately disqualify. I don't think they are a right fit for you right now. Um These are the reasons why I would love to hop on a call with you if something changes within the context you've given me any other time. Uh I will call you a few months later if that's okay, just to check in on you. Because I know for a fact because he's in a line, irrelevant of him going in the market, he's going

54:54to [ __ ] it up. He's going to burn his hand because some sales guy is going to tell you, "Yes, I will do it." And then when he burns his hand and I call him 6 months later and he's burnt his hand because he's wasn't ever aligned and whoever bought it from him never aligned him. Now, he will actually

55:09listen to me. So, I'm okay disqualifying. Got it. Okay? So, now that they have passed the need gate, second is decision-making and timeline gate. So, first question is, "Are you the only person who makes decisions for this?" No. Or do you have No, I mean, are you Or is Who's the other person who generally

55:33makes these decisions? It's my manager. Are you open to getting her on a call right now? No. She doesn't have time. She doesn't When do you think she would have time? She won't have time. Can I say something? Yeah. Can I be honest? So, generally what ends up happening is whenever something because this affects your business, right? And it's something that your manager, I'm assuming, is going to get affected by it if this works or doesn't

55:54work. Even if you are completely convinced, unless you are able to translate everything to her, which I have been learning how to do over the last 4 years that you're going to pick up in the next 30 minutes, she is probably going to lose context and why you would want to move forward. No, but I think I can do it. Completely okay. I am very aligned with you. Can we do one thing easier? Because I because your need is aligned, it looks like it works. I'll walk you through the

56:22service. If it makes sense, would you be open to bringing her on call? She's just too busy. Mhm. Can I ask you a question? Assuming you hear everything that makes sense, would you be able to make that decision without her? No. So, you won't be able to make a decision without her. And I can't bring her on call.

56:47You can't bring her on call. How does the decision-making process look like? I take the proposal to her. I explain it to her. If she says yes, we go ahead. If she says no, And what are the things do you think she is probably looking for? Everything that I just told you, all my

57:05needs. Okay, no problem. So, then we'll move forward. So, in B2B, I will still allow because you still need champions. If it's somebody who is like, "Oh, my business partner." And so, I'm like, "Listen, dude, I can't I can't move forward." Okay. So, depending on Can you reject me? Yeah, listen. I I would love to help you, but given the way we operate, we want to make sure that everybody who is on the other side is aligned. And the reason why we want this to happen is if they're not aligned, we know you're going to come in and kill it. But, if they don't know why we are doing it, it

57:38almost becomes an upward battle. So, even if you do end up giving us money and we start doing the service, it becomes too frictional. So, let's do one thing. If your manager can't hop on a call, I completely understand. Can we take a pause? I don't It doesn't matter if it's a month from now. Let's hop on a

57:52call then. Does that sound okay? So, it's very Yeah, but I would really appreciate if the pitch is given to me because I would like to take it to the manager. So, let's say the act is a gatekeeper over here. No, I love it and I'm I'm completely in agreement with you, but the point is I can give you a pitch. I'll send you a proposal, but that proposal, unless you get context, it's almost impossible. And but more than just pitching it to her, I need to know whether she's the right fit for us as well because it's a two-way thing, right? We're trying to build something

58:25together. Assume me and you get along, but she's not aligned with us. She doesn't have time for this call and we are supposed to be making content where we need her make her decision. But sir, then I think I'll just go to somebody else. I I'm with you. I completely understand. Now, do you let her go?

58:39Yeah, yeah. Okay. Why so? I tell her here's another 10 agencies' numbers. Please take it. Because she's problematic. Bad client. Bad client. My rule is simple. I'm not trying to close anyone. Like I wouldn't even stretch it this far. Can I be honest how I would do it? Yeah. I would just be like, "Oh, you can't get your manager on call? Okay. Listen, man, there's only two ways we can move

58:57forward. One is we are either all aligned or we are not aligned. If we are not all aligned, tomorrow we are going to have problems. Can you align her or not? Because if she doesn't get on a call, I can't move forward." So, I have moods. Depending on which mood I am in, if I wake up a little more

59:14pissy, I'll be a little pissy about it. Okay. Let's decision make So, So, one gate two is who is the decision maker? If it's a So, here you have B2B B B2C. B2C, if they are not getting the decision maker on a call, you tell them [ __ ] off. B to B, it's almost impossible to get those decision makers on call unless it's aligned. So, here you need to make

59:40this person a champion. So, you need to go from this to we are both aligned and they want to do it. Beautiful. So, we call it champion creation. So, here what you want to know is, "Hey, I love that. No problem. They don't have to hop on a call right now. Can you walk me through how decision-making process looks like for your organization?" This

1:00:00is very important for two reasons. Number one, when you're following up, you should know what that process looks like for them. Cuz if the process is 2 months and you're following up every day, you've irked them now. So, something that could have worked out is not going to work out because you're not aware of what their process But let's say they give you vague answers like, "Okay, we'll just send this to the team and the marketing team

1:00:20will decide." Can I hop on a call with the marketing team? I I'm I'm ready. I'm here. Who do you want me to talk to? So, the goal is to get to the decision maker. Get to the decision maker. That But if if you make this person a true champion, the champion will take you. You'll have noticed this if you've ever done you've you've done this long enough. Every organization who comes to you has a

1:00:39champion who's a lover of Ganesh. Yeah. That champion will drive you to the decision maker. Now, really depends on which stage that company is at. Now, for example, if I tell I want to talk to the CEO of a company that's doing 5,000 crores for social media, they're going to tell me [ __ ] off. Right? So, the question is what is your decision-making process? Who are the people who make decisions? What are the criteria's to make decisions on? So, that you can equip the champion and you can give more information based on the timelines and the processes that you've

1:01:09become aware of for the B to B. Understood. The longer process, bigger payout. But if it's B to C, small people team, that's where you kind of be like, "Listen, dude. Do you want this to work or not? Do you want this for you? Like, do you really want this for you? Cuz I can make it easy. I can sell you something. I can convince you to buy. You'll pay the money. We're going to have friction

1:01:26later. Or do you want to actually do this in a way where it actually works for you guys? Got it. Yeah? Okay, in order for that, I need to make sure that your entire team is aligned. So, when are you available to bring your co-founder on? I have told people who get on a car So, one of the things that people do is sales people do. So, they'll come on a

1:01:45call, sales call with in their cars. In the middle of some random thing they're doing. They're And then I'm like, I'm not taking this call. Oh, how do you politely say that? I'm like, oh, dude, it seems like you're very busy. Uh is Are you okay to take a call right now? But let's say they say, "I'm so sorry.

1:02:00I've just come out." I am completely understanding. Can I tell you something? The weird thing about my sales calls is I need to share my screen so that I can show you stuff. When you're driving, almost impossible for me to do that. But that's okay. I'll manage. But I'll never be able to actually walk you through what it requires because that's what I need in order for me to be

1:02:17able to help you. Let's do one thing. Don't worry about the timing. When are you going to get back in the office? I'm assuming you're going to be busy, right? actually I'll be going abroad. So, it will take me a month to get back. Then I think we should We'll have this conversation a month later.

1:02:30Oh, okay. Can I tell me why? Because this guy is not If he's going to go a month abroad, he's not making that decision anyway. Oh. So, why would I want to have a sales call right now? I would rather him come back and then have a call with him then. When he has the capacity to make a

1:02:44decision. Perfect. Understood. If it's not, that means it's not really important for them anyway to begin. So, you have to become conscious of that. So, you find out decision maker, decision-making process, and timeline. What do you say timeline? When are you looking to make a decision? This is very important. Because once you understand when are you looking to make a decision, you have to categorize them

1:03:06into two different categories. Somebody who's looking to make a decision now becomes a hot lead. This is somebody who you should put pressure on. But somebody who's looking to make a decision 3 months from now, and you have to ask them why 3 months and like align them and you try to like objection handle it. But if they have true like reason to start from 3 months from now, and you start putting pressure on them, they are called nurture leads. These are people you have to nurture, not put pressure. What ends up happening is we don't know who we are supposed to put

1:03:33pressure on, who we are nurturing. So, we find out timelines, so we know when we are doing follow-ups, when we are talking to them. Should we tell them, "Listen, buddy, you would need to take action." Or how's your day going? How's your dog? Is everything good? By the way, this crazy thing happened for

1:03:47our client. We are so excited. Let's talk 3 months later. So, it's a different experience. Now, for the person person who has to make a decision now, if you treat him as a nurtured lead, you're not putting pressure enough for him to close. But for a person who needs to buy 3 months from now, you start calling him every third day, "Why are you not buying? Why are you" That guy who would have probably bought is not going to buy

1:04:08because it's bothering him now. So, timeline is very important to understand where to put pressure, where not to put pressure. So, what qualifies as a hot and what qualifies as a cold lead? Hot is anyone looking to make a decision now. Now, as in within the first week. Anything beyond that with a justifiable

1:04:26reason. This is the caveat is they can't just say 3 months from now. Why 3 months from now also have to be justified. If that is [ __ ] you need to realign them. For example, let's say they say, "We are planning now for the next quarter." Then that's a justified B2B is justified. B2B B2B makes quarterly decision. But if just a random guy is like, "Oh, because life is hard

1:04:48right now. I'm very busy." That is not justifiable because he's going to be busy 3 months from now also. That's where you have to realign them cuz that's when you have to be like, "Listen, can I ask you something? You're busy right now. Your business is going up. Correct? What's going to change in 3 months that's going to make you stop being

1:05:03busy?" How long have you been thinking about doing this and procrastinating? I you actually wanting to make a decision cuz I can call you back in 3 months and we can figure this out. But correct me if I'm wrong. You've been thinking about doing this for a while, right? Okay, now I can let you go and call you back in 3 months where you're still going to be busy or do we try to figure out if we can actually move forward and make this work in a time where you are

1:05:27busy so you can do it forever. That's pretty clear. Right? So, where do you push? Who do you push? When do you say bye? So, as long as you're aligned on that context, you're good to go. So, aligned on timeline, decision-making decision-making process, they pass through gate two. If they are not, you realign them or educate them or

1:05:47disqualify them. Got it. Okay? Now, a decision-maker is not going to come on a call, disqualify. Or realign. But they're not moving forward unless this one of these two things happen. Perfect. Huh. So, you pass this gate, you then go to the third gate. This is where most sales people [ __ ] out and I'm going to say [ __ ] out because I want this to

1:06:08hurt them. Okay. Cuz they're going to hate that I said this. Okay? Budget. How much are you looking to spend? They're like, you tell me how much are you looking to spend. No, you tell me how much are you looking to spend. This is a dance that anyone in sales basically has. Look at her smiling. It basically [laughter] means don't say

1:06:27the price first. So, the thing is whoever says the price first creates an anchor. Whatever is the anchor, it you have to navigate between the anchor. The reason why we don't say price, I have I have actually no problem telling the price. But this is I because a lot of people are listening to this, I want to keep it a little bit more general. Because of my because of the demand and supply situation for me, my [ __ ] like but I don't say it first. I ask, what are you

1:06:51looking to spend? Ask me, I don't know. I don't know. What is your budget? Say, I don't know what's your budget. I like, what are you looking to spend? Um I don't know, you tell me. I mean, in order for me to be able to figure out whether we can actually help you or not. We have a ranges of services that can be between 2 lakhs to

1:07:09say 15 lakhs. In order for me to understand which one of them to give it to you, I need to know which one of the brackets do you come under. So, what's the budget you're looking to spend? See, I don't know again. You would tell me I don't know. You'll have to tell me. So, can Is it okay if I make a proposal

1:07:23for like 20 lakhs for you? So, I'll say something absurd as a number. No, I'll say something absurd for this. It should never be that. Okay. Then they're like, "No, no, no, no." I'm like, "Then what's the budget?" Oh, so that's the anchor. So, overwhelm them. So, I over if if they're not align aligning on the budget, like if I would say, "Oh, you want to get on Ganesh's

1:07:41podcast? Awesome, it's 5 crores." You tell me the budget, 5 crores. I can take FOUR ALSO, GUYS. [laughter] RIGHT? THE IDEA IS FOR THEM the number becomes so overwhelming that they will tell you what their budget is. "No, it's around this." I'm like, "Yes, awesome." So, the reason why we ask for a budget is because see, don't worry, my price is not going to change based on

1:08:02what you tell me. Because I want to make sure we are aligned. Now, if the budget is too low, I want to ask them one of two questions. Is this low because you don't have access to capital? Are you broke? Or is this low because you don't want to allocate this capital to this particular

1:08:21thing? If they don't have access to capital, they are disqualified. If it's allocation, that means I just need to show them value. Which then I will ask them a question. If everything goes well and if it makes sense and what we are able to provide makes sense, this is the price. Is this something you'd be open to investing if

1:08:41it makes sense to you? Cuz if it doesn't make sense, why am I pitching it to you anyway? So, if allocation is the problem, then nurture. No, then we can go into pitch. Otherwise, disqualify. If they say no even after you explain, "I can't spend this." It's disqualify. Oh, why are you looking to spend this much? Why do you think because the whole idea is now we have passed them through

1:09:05a qualification metric. Once they go through this in this this is by the way a significant chunk of time where you have to go deeper deeper deeper. You have to ask three levels of why at every level you have to realign at every level. You need to educate at every level. Because but this I'll tell you is the most powerful ammunition for

1:09:23sales people. Cuz what ends up happening for example somebody says I won't let somebody pass unless they say they're ready to make a decision. For example today and they come to me in the end be like okay I need a few more days. I said did you lie to me then or are you

1:09:38lying to me right now? Oh, do you just ask that? Yeah. But it's me don't ask that. Like you don't ask that but like I I can because I'm being how to ask that politely. Be like hey I'm a little confused cuz you know when I asked you what your timeline looks like you said you're

1:09:51looking to make a decision right now. What changed between then and now? So that's a nicer way of saying Are you lying to me? Are you lying to me? Right? So you want to ask them what changed? Either you lied there or you lied here. Which one is it? If so which why? So this gate is basically ammunition for

1:10:10objection handling. Oh it's too expensive but you told me if the value aligned so is the value not aligned? Are you not seeing the value? Because I told you if the value aligned the price is going to be this. Now you can't tell me too expensive because I would have disqualified you. Why are you

1:10:25wasting my time? This is so important in deep discovery because this becomes ammunition for objection handling. If you do this right at the end of the call they are either buying or they say sorry. Cuz they shouldn't have passed. If you have passed means you have aligned then either you did not understand the value of what I'm giving. Which if I'm if the offer is unique

1:10:57enough, should not be the case. Got it. So, then you'll have to go to the foundations. Then we have to go back to the foundation. Beautiful. This is gates of hell. This is my favorite. So, no prospect goes into pitching. You know how sales people like, "How do I get the best pitch?" No,

1:11:11get this right. Deep discovery right, which is a function of clarity, decision-making, timeline, and budget. Yes. Okay? Now, after this, you are going into the pitch. Okay? Now, the pitch is fun. Okay. So, the pitch starts with "Can I ask you a question?" The idea is you need to ask them. This is one of the

1:11:34ways you can do it. This is my method. There is a belief that they have. What is a question that will make me understand what their core beliefs is that my service breaks? Your belief was it takes time for content to work. I told you it's going to take 6 days. It should be a

1:11:54breakthrough moment. Unbelievable. So, what is a belief-breaking question? Is a question you ask to then get them open to the pitch. But for that, we need to have a belief-breaking answer also, right? Yeah. It has to be something so mind-blowing. Yeah. It has to be absurd. The thing is all of this works if your service is

1:12:18good. Like, if your service is not good, I I can you can do this and it'll still work even if you can't tend. But like, once they buy, shit's going to hit the fan, right? Whatever, right? So, this is assuming you have a decent enough service to offer. Okay? So, I have a belief-breaking question.

1:12:39Okay? From a belief-breaking question, I go to proof. That is I showed you the videos. That's my testimonials videos proof. My value stack. I showed you what it Then I go into so we go belief breaking question, proof. You can't break their belief and not show proof. If you don't have proof, you have nothing to break. Right? And that proof has to back it up. After that, you go

1:13:07into pitch. Pitch has two components, okay? Component number one is um method, what we do. This is a my hyper niche I speak in the hyper niche, right? Then part two is process. They should cover what, why, where, when, how. All of that these both should cover, the method and process. And at this point, if you have done this right,

1:13:39you have to shut up. Okay. Because when you shut up, they'll ask you how much. This is given the condition that in the starting you haven't anchored price. Sometimes when you ask for a budget, the budget is automatically aligned and then you move forward. You don't tell them your price. But you've already told them

1:13:56the price, you shut up. And they ask you, how do we move forward? They have to ask you what we call as buying questions. They ask. They ask buying questions. Okay? If they are not asking buying questions and they are having objections, that means you have not done deep discovery properly. That means you have

1:14:18done not done the method pitch properly. Work on that. Because most of that should be unless he's a liar, that means he's lied to you. Then you can catch him. Right? So then you go into There are times where you will go into objection handling. Objection handling framework is very simple. I completely agree. Tell me why you

1:14:37believe that. Just get them to dig deeper to break whatever the surface answer they believe in. Okay? So, price At price, you have what you call as closing statement. After buying question. After buying question. So, what How How do we proceed further? Or if they don't ask, you can create a buying format. So, this is where the

1:15:01closing happens. This is where you ask. Most sales people don't ask for the sales. So, for one of the best ones that work really far really really really good is that one to 10 close. The one to 10 close is literally one being I want to 10 being I want to buy it right now. One being I absolutely hate it. Where are you? After the entire

1:15:23pitch. Now, it makes more sense, right? Do you remember we did one to 10? Yeah. So, 10 being take my money. One being I absolutely hate it. Where are you? Seven? Why not a one? Why do you I mean, why not a 10? 10 is One second. Let me just write it so that it doesn't confuse you.

1:15:4010 being I I want this right now. 10 I want now. One is I hate it. hate it. Where are you? And they say seven. You ask them why not one. Why don't you hate it? The cost is too high. No, no. Why do you not hate it? Why do you not hate it? Okay, then

1:15:59they'll give you the reasoning. You have to get them to repeat all the things they love about it. That's why you first ask why not one. Then you don't ask them why not 10. You ask them what would it need to be in order for it to be a 10. Then they'll tell you if this was there,

1:16:17it would have been a 10. Or if the price was this or if this was the situation or if this particular tweak. If it's a small tweak, tweak it and take the money. If it is a massive tweak, go back, do the pitch, do the method, re-align, come back. But, most people actually don't ask for the sale. That is, give me

1:16:38money. If by any chance it doesn't close, you don't let that prospect leave unless the second call is booked on the calendar. This is also a fatal mistake. Okay? Everything aligned. No, it's it's 10. I think it's amazing. I'm going to take it back to my boss. I'm going to make this work. Amazing. How long do you think

1:17:00this generally takes for you? Maybe a week. Amazing. A week looks like Tuesday on my calendar. Are you free at 2:00 p.m. on a Tuesday? Actually, let me know on Monday. You'll let me know on Monday. We can open up a call on Monday. When do you want to do it on Monday? No, I'll let you know on Monday if I'm

1:17:17free on Tuesday. You'll let me know on Monday. See, listen, in order for me to move forward, I need to keep a because I don't want to keep randomly calling you, right? I can harass you. Would you like me to harass you or would you like to rather just have a time? And by the way, before I let you go, I wanted to understand

1:17:30something. I love no's. If you don't want to go through with it in Tuesdays, I will celebrate with you. My objective is to make sure we have a clarity so that we can move forward. So, what time on Monday or Tuesday works for you? No, I want to move ahead, but I'm not so

1:17:46sure. Oh, that means What what's That means I have to That sales call I would never get to there. I would I would not so sure about the timing. Oh, why are you not sure? Because I don't know what my schedule looks like on Tuesday. I mean, you can open up your calendar. Yeah, right now my calendar is not

1:18:04booked, but it'll get booked by Monday. My CEO is meeting tell you something? This would never happen. Because this character would have been disqualified long back. No one will come to this point will give me resistance. It's impossible. Never happened in my life. Got it. Like it's it's not going to happen. Because either they wouldn't be aligned with the pitch, so I would tell them, "Hey, I don't think we are on the same page. I don't think it would work." I would

1:18:31never book the second call. Like I get where you're coming from. Most sales people should This is If you try to solve this, you are in the wrong place. You have done the first part whole thing wrong. You have done everything else wrong because why this person is giving you If this person is not getting excited to get on a second call with you, you

1:18:51[ __ ] up the sales call. Got it. You can like remember when I when we did that 100 like he's smiling to take that money? That's how prospect should be when they get on a sales call with you cuz they are excited that you're going to solve their problem finally. Why would they not want to get on a

1:19:08second call? So, this scenario never happens. If you do the other parts right. Okay. So, second call. So, the you never let So, you always say, "Okay, decision-making call. If you're not ready to make a decision today, a week later, no problem, but you have to book a call before you go." Because there is no random follow-up. Or they could also say, "No, just send

1:19:28me the deck and we'll then get on call." Never happen. Okay. Again, if you do this right, would never happen. It's a sales call. It is okay if you hound me. And take follow-ups. I would love to do that, but I would still like to have a time block. Again, I wouldn't allow that to happen.

1:19:42Okay. Okay. Understood. Like by the time they come here, the people who would ever do that would have already been disqualified. That's why I'm telling people who come until here, they are either buying from me or they just can't afford it. Understood. That again gives you more clarity. Yeah. My close rate is somewhere between

1:20:0140 to 50% today. So, like it's It's not that. That doesn't happen. Got it. What should be the architecture of my team to ensure that there is a brain thinking about the offer, the brand, the sales, and also the macro aspect of how my brand is being projected? Okay. Can you put Can you give me the

1:20:20architecture of the team? So, the offer is always the CEO. Because he's the binding force, the one is always the CEO. Yeah. So, the one who creates the offer is a CEO with a CMO and C CSO, that's a sales officer. Because the sales officer knows what people will buy, the CMO will know how to market it, but the CEO can merge the two. The CEO is the one who can take the information from the both plus the delivery team in terms of figuring out what's actually possible, what's not possible, and come up with

1:20:48the offer. The onus is on the CEO. So, it's me, I handle everything sales. So, all things sales all things sales and lead generation come up to come to me. So, that means all the activities from building distribution, brand all the way till taking money is my responsibility, my department. the chief sales officer. Chief revenue officer, chief sales officer, chief revenue officer, head of sales, whatever you want to name it,

1:21:13that's who I am, right? I am under the CEO. Shafaq is our creative director. So, basically what you can look at this as ops. This is your ops and delivery team, okay? Then you have CEO, that is Imad, okay? Which is admin, finance, and customer support. So, that's a separate department under Imad outside of Shafaq and Saad.

1:21:38So, how does the flow of project happen? It comes from you It comes from me, goes to Imad. Goes to Imad? It hands over to the CEO. Okay. It hands over to the CEO. CEO does an onboarding call. Okay. Okay. So, it gets onboarded and then it he attaches a CSM here. What is a CSM?

1:21:56Customer success manager. Okay. Their job is to make sure that whatever this team, the ops team is doing this guy has an ability to go and [ __ ] about it to somebody. Oh, okay. The customer They need someone to [ __ ] to. [snorts] If that someone to [ __ ] to doesn't exist, they're going to come either [ __ ] to me or they're going to [ __ ] to him. If your organization doesn't have a CSM, they're not bitching to your people or you or somebody else, they're bitching to third people outside of your organization. And that third person on outside the organization is not doing

1:22:29you a favor cuz he's not trying to figure out what's actually wrong. He's like, "Huh, wrong problem." That is such an amazing perspective. That is such an amazing perspective. I think this is beautiful. So, in that entire architecture, you need to have the CSM. That's like the therapist. That's the therapist. So, if something goes wrong, if you want to keep it inside the organization, you

1:22:48better have a therapist in house. Otherwise, they're going to go and [ __ ] about you to somebody else. And that's going to cause a problem. This is what reduces churn and keeps retention. Oh, wow. So, this guy needs a punching bag cuz if this guy loses his [ __ ] with the client,

1:23:01he will start losing it with the client. He can't. He loses it with the CSM. CSM is a two-way punching bag. Okay. So, they take [ __ ] from us also. They take [ __ ] from the client also. Okay. But they have They have to be somebody who's very calm. You're absolutely right.

1:23:17To both? To both. Everybody CSM is a wall. It's a brick wall that people are coming, punching all day and leaving. That's their only skill level. Should be able to take it. And say you're right to everyone. Yeah, yeah. You're absolutely right. I'm going to make sure these people are going to [ __ ] fix this [ __ ]

1:23:36Okay. Right? Like that's the And then you're going to come to Shephard and be like, "Listen, you are absolutely right. You don't have to worry. I will take care of the [ __ ] 90% of the time you just have to tell both people they are right and they'll let go eventually." Okay? Cuz they just need to be taking [ __ ] from [laughter] So, give assurance to both and just let them continue to do their work so that

1:23:56no no heat goes in. Mhm. One more thing. Make sure that what Saad has told and what we do are aligned. Because if the sale was made wrong before it enters the system, it needs to be corrected. Cuz if you don't correct it, it's a cancer. It kills the organization. So, what he does is I put him up on here. And if he's seeing that this guy is not aligned

1:24:24properly he'll send it back to me. Money is collected. We give them an option of a refund. Go back talk to Saad. I think there are some misalignments here. I think you need to get clearer about what we actually do. Once you align on that we are more than happy to move forward. But that it doesn't come into the creative side unless they are absolutely clear. So on the sales side expectations is one of the biggest problems because sales people Kabhi Kabhi Na they are

1:24:48under pressure. So One is they lie outright which is the [ __ ] are you doing? The other part is they hide the truth conveniently to make a sale. That is a second problem. So that is very important because in order for especially when you're trying to hit methodologies. So when you're trying when you're going to super premium premium higher price point you're trying to solve specific problems for a super specific high-level individuals across the world. Like this is not just this this is with my sales contracts with with the UK companies with anything that's super high ticket. You're solving something very specific for very specific type of people. If the

1:25:26alignment is not right no everything gets problematic. So the job of the CEO is to make sure that before he passes it through one is he understands clearly what you're trying to look for. Second is is the sale done properly? Because if the sale is not done properly he has to get him out of the system. Otherwise he's going to come into the

1:25:44system and create chaos in the system. Got it. And that too after the execution happens which is going to be very costly. it's it's going to be ridiculous after that. So then it happens to every service. There's no service business who can tell me I don't get bad clients. That bad client has come in because your

1:25:58sales person has allowed that to happen. The owners of a bad client is on the sales person. Perfect. Are we done? This is it yeah. This is all the best. You do this. I hopefully you will be able to make some [ __ ] dough and then kill some [ __ ] and then

1:26:13This is amazing. It was awesome. You guys are awesome. Thank you so much. Thanks, cool. It's amazing. Bye. Thanks so much. Okay. [music]

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