# Fill Your Lobby with Partners That Can Refer Your SaaS with Leonardo Barrientos

Channel: Rob Walling
Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_9GwLbncsc
Duration: 37 min
Language: English - Default
Words: 6451
Transcript page: https://viewrankai.com/tools/youtube-transcript/f_9GwLbncsc

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[0:03] (upbeat 8-bit music) - Our next keynote is from Leo Barrientos. He is the Co-founder and CEO of Lexgo. It's at Lexgo.cl, which is legal services for modern companies. That's at least the translation I get when I look at their homepage. It's "Servicios legales para empresas modernas" That's as bad as my Spanish is. But yeah, Leo, welcome to the show.

[0:30] Thanks for joining us. - Thank you, Rob. It's a pleasure. - Yeah. And so just so folks know, Lexgo has two sides to the business model, but you're focused on being a legal SaaS app, and you do have some one-off consulting and contract work that you are... It's not consultant or contract. It's just legal work that you outsource to some partners. But you're focused on South America, and you do have a large component of your business is the subscription that people pay just to have access to documents and signing and filling out, completing documents

[1:05] in your app. - Yep, exactly. What we felt is that, at least for the time being, if you want to blow up your subscription model, you'll need for, as a last resort for users to get in contact with lawyers to just learn how to use the proper documentation for all sorts of different processes. So we make a lot of sense for us to have that access while we push you should be using our SaaS because it's cheaper, easier, faster

[1:34] than just use regular lawyers. - Excellent. All right. So let's dive in. You're gonna be talking today about partnership marketing and really how you, in the early days of Lexgo, 'cause now you have quite good traction. You and I have spoken offline about your revenue and how everything's going, but partnership marketing was really how

[1:52] you got your kickstart. So, Xander, if we can bring up Leo's slides, and we will start to roll through it. - Yeah, for sure. So as Rob said, we are nowadays an automated legal service for startups. What we try to do is enable founders to complete all of their legal processes that their company needs much faster,

[2:11] and a fraction of the cost of lawyers. Also, how we did that is just automating tons of legal workflows so founders can incorporate their company in different countries of the world, hire their employees, and do even some fundraising rounds through the platform without having to pay the premium that usually is involved while working with lawyers. So, but of course, or product wasn't like that

[2:34] at the beginning. What we did it, I will say that, by the beginning, we were some sort of Avodocs, which is a YC company with a dumb Stripe Atlas. And what I mean with a dumb Stripe Atlas is we automated all the legal paperwork, but of course, all their registration process was in order just because we wanted to test who will be the real users

[2:56] of Lexgo at the beginning. And actually, we did this while we were in the Start-Up Chile program back in 2017, and we quickly came out with our three

[3:16] At the beginning, Lexgo was a B2C platform. So we were focused on consumers that, I don't know, they have one or two legal problems each year and that's that. So we actually spent much more money than what we get from selling to them. And the other typical problem that we have is it was very difficult for us to qualify to each of the new users that we have in the platform because we were able to acquire from solopreneurs to a small businesses, into tech companies, medium to big companies, which was insane

[3:47] because the product was built for consumers. But you can tell that there was a huge need of a product like Lexgo. And I think very connected to this point is that small and medium businesses don't face the same legal challenges that a startup will face. So legal spending on legal was very different between each of these companies, which at the beginning of a new company, was very difficult to say which of the features or products shall we focus

[4:17] in order to move forward. And the interesting part is that, while we were in Start-Up Chile, the funding from Start-Up Chile was very small. I remember by my time it was like 25,000 with a small investment from (indistinct). So we were covering our tech team and the founder salaries for the beginning and we didn't have too much money

[4:42] in order to just sell Lexgo. So we had to come up with a strategy to acquire new users almost free. So we take advantage of that. We were going through the program, we have Start-Up Chile at that time had a batch of, I don't know, 60 to 80 companies, and they were the first focus for use. Like, "Please let me know if Lexgo is working for you,

[5:07] what you were expecting from Lexgo." And we knew that there was a huge problem for Start-Up Chile. Most incubators and accelerators, especially the ones that work with international companies have a very hard time dealing with the soft landing of those companies in the country, and how the structure subsidiaries around the word, how to comply with local regulations, et cetera. For us, was very natural to go into that place and tell them like, "Hey, I can take care of this problem for you

[5:37] and I can act as a partner. So I can offer you up some sort of discounted price on our services in order to deal with all of your portfolio companies that are coming to Chile." And from the user perspective, there was, "I really like this bundle of products in which that you arrive to Chile or the U.S., or whichever other country, and there's a company that can help you, not only with incorporating what you need to go through this program, but also just complying

[6:03] with all of the details of accounting, taxes, et cetera." So that's, that's why we created very quickly this straight up with us for Chile. All of our revenue in this next eight months of that scope came from this. Very straightforward, and I will say that version two, which was the process of going from a B2C to B2B platform was almost entirely focused on helping these companies and startups build their companies around the world

[6:37] and scale their operation through the region. So maybe for those who don't know how a Stripe Atlas work, maybe this is some difference with Lexgo Global, which is our incorporation product, is that we just wanted to offer an easy way to incorporate international startups in the markets They need to to be operating. So the product not only includes company incorporation, but also goes with accounting and taxes

[7:05] and some banking solutions. And all of these products and services are controlled through the Lexgo platform. So this was very interesting because, not only this was the first way to acquire a bunch of clients, but also if you did a good job with them, they will refer you to new clients and other founders who are working on the same kind of issues, and there's a virtual cycle in which the word of mouth help us acquire

[7:35] all of our new clients. - I'm gonna pop in here, Leo. - Yeah. - I love it. There's a couple of learnings already that may not even directly relate to partnerships, but one is you started B2C, 'cause a lot of us, that's our exposure as consumers, and we're going to build a startup, and why don't we serve consumers?

[7:51] And a lot of us find that that's... It's not a never do, but my guidance is that 80-90% of the time, if you really do wanna do this and you wanna build a sustainable, ambitious SaaS product without raising a bunch of funding, usually B2B is the way to go. The other thing is, you found out pretty early, or I love the way you said that your early version

[8:14] of Lexgo was Avodocs plus Stripe Atlas. And you didn't mean that you combined those two, you meant that that's what the platform essentially did. You looked elsewhere into a separate market, which was really the US market, and you said, "Well, that exists in the U.S., so why can't it exist for South American countries?" And then, I love, really,

[8:35] the focus that we're about to dive into on partnerships. I'll let you continue from there. - Yeah, for sure. Yeah. The cool thing about the whole process is that, actually, our own users tell us what we should be building. And then, as I said, it was very clear while in the B2C market, you could tell that the market wasn't big or mature enough

[8:58] to want it to have access to these kind of solutions. So, as I was speaking of, this first partnership with Start-Up Chile make a lot of sense for us, and they were actually very relieved that they can count on Lexgo to solve the issue for the portfolio companies. And we were these just trying to replicate the same model for every local incubator and accelerator that we could estimate they have the same problem,

[9:23] and they did. They were working, some of them, with other law firms, but we go back to the same problem, the real problem, right? Lawyers are too expensive. I don't want to spend the premium that I need to in order to incorporate. Various standard companies implement various standard paperwork and so on. So after working with all of the local and incubators and accelerators, you could tell that Lexgo was transitioning

[9:47] to some sort of company management in a box. We were not only dealing with how you solve the legal issue of your company, but also how you comply with all of the obligation that comes with opening a company, and then having a presence in all of the countries. And this is how we went to our second, I will say, series

[10:07] of partnerships that make a lot of sense to us. It's was that, because we didn't want to spend time on building a product that wasn't core and wasn't our main base of what the Lexgo product should do, is that we have to complement the product with auxiliary complimentary services, like accounting, taxes, banking, et cetera,

[10:30] just in order to have this company management, right. So this was cool because, not only we were achieving having a more robust product that solves all of the issues that founders were facing, but also you could tell from the beginning that this, of course, could be a great channel of acquisition for us, just because if we are sending our users to have access to accounting SaaS, some tax compliance, banking solutions, et cetera,

[10:59] they could do the same for us, right? Whenever users from these companies were facing legal issues, our great way to solve them in order to provide their final services was sending them to Lexgo because we can take care of all legal paperwork, advice that is needed, et cetera. - Right. And if I can pop in here, I think a key here is that you found an aspirin pain,

[11:26] aspirin versus vitamin, right? It's not, "Hey, maybe someday you need some legal protection." It's like, "Right now you need to incorporate or you need an IP agreement for your employees, or you need hiring agreements, just whatever you need." And you know that a lot of these companies, pretty much all the companies, need it, and it's too expensive and it's too cumbersome,

[11:46] and referring people out to law firms is a pain. And so these partners, you're saying value added partners there, these accelerators constantly, we see it with Tiny Seed we just constantly see this need for companies that have to do the same thing over and over. And so when you engage these partners, it was just an obvious, "Oh. If you can take this pain away from our companies,

[12:09] you take this pain away from us." Right? And I think that's a key part of the story. - Yeah. I think that's completely right. And maybe just giving an example makes a lot of sense. So for example, we work with a Chilean startup that is called Book. They do payroll services as SaaS, too. And of course, they don't provide any kind of legal advice about how you fire, how you deal with certain situations

[12:35] while working with your employees. So the product kinked some sort of deadlock when their uses had that problem. So the ask Book, like, "Hey, how kind I fire? What kind of justification I can do to do so in most of South American countries making some framework around this?" You need a justification in order to fire someone. You can do it right away, or you'll pay some fine

[12:57] and higher amounts that you should. So of course they couldn't provide a service because we were already working in that partnership. We say like, "Hey, why we don't do it?" Just with add a bot, and that helps you very quickly to ask advice to the Lexgo team about this. And they will inform what's the best cost for firing an employee through your platform, and you can calculate everything

[13:18] and the whole process through Book. So that made a lot of sense because they weren't able to provide their service properly because they were missing legal advice. Of course, with every one of these SaaS companies that are making a lot of sense working together, what we did is, of course, we offer discounted prices to each other, and also these integrations that will helps you to offer a more robust product just because the whole experience for the end user is much better when I can solve everything that it need, even legal, accounting,

[13:49] or taxes in the same platform of each of our companies. And that's why we said that we are providing a solution to a need just to making those platforms better. And it's the same for the Lexgo case. And the cool thing is that, because, even today, we have a very limited technical team, is that we can focus on the things

[14:10] that make us very powerful against competition. But because we know that is a huge pain about dealing with all the things that are related to managing your company, we needed to do those integration of partnerships in order to just provide a product that solves the pain in its entirety. And I just wanted to talk a little bit about on a specific partnership with Clay,

[14:38] which is the first partnership we closed. Clay's a Chilean startup also that they offer accounting as a software as a service solution. And of course, as I was saying, we offered a discounted price of call service when you buy Lexgo Global or you hire any of our certain subscription plans in the platform. And of course, we integrate with them from sales contracts that you sign and create in Lexgo,

[15:06] but also some payroll features, et cetera. And of course, what we negotiate with them is that if we're gonna be an important channel of acquisition for you, we will like to have certain percentage of the subscription plans we help you close. And I think, even for the time being, it's 5% of whatever they pay for them.

[15:26] And at the same time, normally we refer clients to Clay. They also did with us, because for example, there were a lot of issues with some tax quantification or how to count from safe convertible knowledge, which everyone who has dealt with this know they're a little tricky to manage from accounting and tax perspective.

[15:47] They didn't know how to deal with them. So of course, whenever Clay uses, needs some sort of tax or legal advice about how to deal with other companies, they refer directly to Lexgo, and we offer either a project or one of our subscription plans, if that makes sense to them. Like we said before, this make a lot of sense because we were both feeling this pain of not having access to, in the case of Lexgo, accounting services that complement our solutions and in the case of them, they weren't able to offer their plans

[16:15] because they have some deadlocks about tax and legal advice. And this was pretty cool because, with just partnership, that make a lot of sense to our product. I think last year we had $4,000 on revenue just for this referrals. So it's incredible how they can add a lot of your MRR or ARR just having someone

[16:41] who helps you provide a good product. And also, it's a great acquisition channel for you, and little revenue just for doing that effort. And I think you can do that with dumps of other companies that make sense to partner with. I think nowadays we have expanded to a lot of other things like SaaS to different countries. Of course, we've partnered with Amazon Web Services, Stripe, helping South American companies that need to do a flip swap to the U.S., and they need to deal with legal management of a U.S. company, which is the same case as U.S. or foreign founders

[17:19] coming to South America. So I would love to just make Lexgo the buffer in which you know you can deal with everything that goes with company management as you scale your operation through the world.

[17:36] I don't know, Rob, if you wanna get into this, or we should just speak about some specifics, but I just wanted to show you about this couple of cases in which partnerships were very effective. Of course, if I start speaking about every one of them that we now have, we could stay for another 30 minutes.

[17:56] - [Rob] Sure. Yeah. There's a lot of examples. - But you guys get it. - Yeah, yeah. Let's see if there are any questions from the audience. I'm checking our Producer. Xander, you can send me any questions that come up.

[18:12] I do have a question for you. So what kind of... I guess, obviously, Start-Up Chile was the first partnership that you had, and then you added additional accelerators after that. Right? And do you feel like the results from the initial partnership? 'Cause obviously you have a unique relationship with Start-Up Chile and that they decided,

[18:34] they gave you some funding. It was a small amount of funding, but that makes it easier to have a partnership. You still solved the desperate need they had, and they wouldn't have used as a customer or a referral if you didn't solve that. That one feels like a no brainer and an easy one to close, where the other partnerships you were attempting to close, were they harder because there was more, perhaps, distance

[18:58] 'cause other accelerators hadn't given you funding? And so, it was really a traditional business development relationship that you had to build. - Yeah. It's a great question. And the whole experience with Start-Up Chile gave you a lot of insight about what were the challenges our accelerators were facing, which are, I think, the same. First of all, they don't really know how to deal with international companies, and those services are quite expensive,

[19:24] especially because of that. So of course, some of these accelerators had partnerships with other law firms or lawyers, but the pricing was way too high for their portfolio company. So when you offered them an ultimate solution that could scale very quickly of course they will have access to legal advice if needed, but they just have like an initial price, and that makes sense for companies

[19:47] that are just starting. So it wasn't difficult for us at all to close those partnerships because, first of all, Start-Up Chile was a good brand in Chile, the most famous accelerator by far. So just working with them, and were part of the last batch for them was like, I don't know, a good sign up for the rest of them. And just because we understand the problem very clearly and we had a solution, which it's price make a lot of sense

[20:14] for the first startup founders. Because what they were telling us is that, when they work with their law firms, is that okay, they'll give them a proposal, which was, I don't know, six times more expensive than using any of the Lexgo products. And okay, so founders decided not to solve that issue. So they asked the accelerator.

[20:34] They still had the problem with a portfolio company. They know they have them, they know expensive, and the founders just decided not to deal with them. This happens a lot, at least in South America. And this is why you have huge legal expenses when you try to flip/swap companies into the U.S. just because you need to deal with cap tables that are a mess,

[20:53] documentation that is not in order, et cetera. So the feat was just way too perfect. And now, that the problem was yet how we reach all the accelerators incubators, not only Chile, but the rest of South America that are facing similar challenges. - Right. All right. We do have some questions coming in. Justin Kissner asked, "How do you find potential partners? What are the key parameters you think about

[21:19] when forming a partnership agreement?" I actually want to weigh in on that real quick just to give people a mental framework that I've used. There are referral partnerships, which is what you've talked about, where you provide so much value that they can't get anywhere else or that they get it anywhere else, it's really expensive.

[21:35] That it's just a no brainer for them to refer people to you. And those are unique. There aren't a lot of them, but if you can do what you've done and fill such a desperate need in the market, that's a great way to go. The second type I think of is an integration partner where you have to write some code, and the traditional thought processes, you integrate with Zapier, or we integrated with Pipedrive and with Basecamp, and then you get on their Stripe and you try to get them to promote

[22:06] you try to get on their app list. That's the second kind.

[22:13] The third kind is kind of a subset of the first one that you do where they take an affiliate commission. You essentially pay them a 10%, 20%, 30% kickback for referring you. That's pretty common as well. And the last one that I've done is called a joint venture partnership, where you say, "Hey, we're complimentary tools or complimentary applications, and we're each gonna email our customer list,

[22:36] email our marketing list." And we're not going to do affiliate revenue. I'm just gonna say, "Hey, we use your tool and we like it." And you say the same thing. And hopefully you're being honest when you say that, but then you just get to keep the spoils. So those are kind of the three slash four

[22:51] partnership things that I've seen. Just so people have a mental model it doesn't have to necessarily be the type you've talked about. But back to the question is, how do you find potential partners? And I'd love to hear your thoughts first, and then I can weigh in if there's other thoughts. - Yeah. I think we did all of the formulas

[23:11] that you just spoke about. So we try them all. How you find these partners? Actually, because we knew from the beginning that Startup Chile had this problem, we went straight to all the local accelerators and incubators to do the same. Then of course, you start analyzing, okay, if this kind of organization have this problem,

[23:33] what kind of other legal problems other organizations have? And of course, and this is interesting because we've dealt with other organization of companies that are not the companies or are small, medium businesses, some pro bono, organizations that just needed to help companies at cheaper prices so they can buy us some subscription or services in volume, but actually the one that we get very quick is that other SaaS companies or tech companies

[24:07] are actually also dealing with acquisition, right? So normally, we hit two birds with one shot, in the sense that we could help them get more clients, and we also can help each of our products be better. I think that's like a very easy sell. And of course, because we knew from the first source that our clients were dealing with accounting, taxes, banking, et cetera, we knew that our product needed to include

[24:34] most of them. In the case of Lexgo Global, we not only help with company corporation, but also with whatever you need to comply with local regulations, especially virtual offices and all this stuff, and also banking. If you wanna create a startup, you need the company to comply with everything, and then have a bank account

[24:50] in order to receive payment for your users. Right? So what we did is that we implement some of the different formulas that Rob had just spoken about is that, with the Chilean bank, they pay us for every referred client, or SaaS. We offer this price and we get a little referral percentage. From other more, I will say, I don't know, we start working with some companies

[25:16] and they've been working with us since the beginning. So nowadays, we have an agreement that is a little robust in the sense that normally we do cross marketing between each other, we have some events run together, we publish content from them in our own blog just to give all of our users going, not only to our services but also to them having access to the databases

[25:37] and so on. So maybe I can speak a little bit about what we're doing nowadays is that because we are now entering in the phase that we understand how Chile and couple local companies are dealing with employment, how some organizations are facing different problems, but just because they need to deal with all of this bunch of companies. Now we're dealing with the problem that how can you scale the company

[25:59] without losing the quality of service that Lexgo has. I don't wanna have another legal provider in that sense. So it's a huge problem because I will say that the LatAm market and South American market, especially from Chile, Colombia, and some other small countries is not as attractive enough for a tech company. So you need to move very quickly through the market just to open it

[26:21] and have access to a bigger, serviceable market. But what you don't want is to deal with, five, four law firms in each of the countries you need to expand. We were going to, okay, who are the organizations that are facing the same problem. And in Chile, you have, for example a government agency that is called ProChile, in which normally they fund companies that need to expand Chilean services or goods but they also give them advice about how to structure the company

[26:52] when they need to expand internationally. So of course, we approach them and say like, "Hey, how are you doing with us?" And yeah, we have some friends and law firms that help us and they have the same problem as Start-Up Chile. So we said like, "Hey, maybe I can create an automated product for each of the countries

[27:09] that you usually scale your operation to. So let me know who are those. Of course, I will love to have a chance to explain them to the current supported companies, like, "Hey, you can have two access to this products and we will help you with a very accessible price, and we know you want to spend your money

[27:28] on your clients, your product, not illegal. So this will make a lot of sense. And this is the last cases of users.

[27:43] - Oh, Leo froze up a bit. Let's see if he comes back. I can always pop in. I think he'll pop in right as I start talking, I bet. I actually have thoughts on this as well. How do you find potential partners? I can tell you what I've done. So when I had an SEO, it's a SaaS SEO keyword tool, I went to Google

[27:59] and I typed in SEO tools, SEO rank trackers. I knew there were just affiliated things that we didn't overlap. And I sent a bunch of cold emails. I sent like 10 cold emails and I got like eight replies to do joint ventures. SEO space is particularly suited for that, but it's also something I've seen work. The other thing we did is, I was trying to do it for Drip,

[28:22] which email service provider. The question that we sat down with the team in front of a whiteboard, and I said, "Okay, we take in leads and we send emails. What happens before, and what happens after in the process? What happens before taking in leads? One is you might have a landing page. Before that you might have a pay-per-click or social media software

[28:45] that are trying to drive traffic to those landing pages. So those happened before. What happens after you get into a system like Drip or a MailChimp? They receive emails, and then what do you want them to do? Usually you want them to raise their hand to become a prospect or a lead, and then they would go into CRM,

[29:01] or you want them to buy something. And so then it's like we'll integrate with Gumroad, PayPal, Stripe. These are the afters. So that is also a cool diagram to have, is what happens before your app in your ecosystem, and what happens after? Not coincidentally, those start as partnerships. Longer term, if you really get big and expand, you'll start to build out or acquire apps

[29:22] that do those same things. So those are two quick thoughts that I have on it. Leo, I'm glad you're back. We have another question for you. - Yeah, sorry. - No, yeah. No problem. This is internet and this is doing it live. So Santiago had a question. He says, "Do you have exclusivity with the accounting slash keeping app that you mentioned,

[29:43] or do you have other relationships?" - Yeah. In the beginning we didn't just because we weren't focused on that. I think the first thing that you need to prove with your partner is you're useful to them. And you knew that you needed them to be on board just because the premier product is better. And when you didn't have them with you

[30:05] you were just lacking that. So when you start proving not only that you're helping them be a better product and also you are referring them a lot of clients, we get into that discussion very quick. So for example, I know that it's a lot of people that get into those details from the beginning.

[30:22] For me, it's a waste of time. I just prefer to go very light on paperwork and agreements at the beginning. And let's just check this in two to three months just to see how everything is working out. And if they have feedback on that idea is positive, I will just say straight forward, like, "Hey,

[30:39] what if we structured this?" We have some referral commissions to each of them. And then we structure some sort of content plan in order to give them some activity to this partnership, which works very well. The typical thing that you do is that, if you close partnership, but you don't activate them, they are completely useless. So we focus just on a couple of them that make a lot of sense to us, and then we put a lot of effort on making them useful

[31:07] for their portfolio company or members. I remember that set up. Chile had tons of different perks, but yeah, they didn't have any contact with them. Maybe some of the bigger companies like Amazon, Facebook, not only they have this partnership with them, but they traveled to Chile to give a workshop on some stuff. So in some sort of sense,

[31:29] they were active on the community. People were interested in working with them and so with us. So we did the same, exactly the same, not only for this accelerators and incubators, but also with our other companies that we work together. We tried to give talks and workshops together, create content that make a lot of sense for our users, for the accounting status, how to deal with legal, and for the legal user,

[31:50] how to deal with accounting. And of course we referred those products when we speak about those issues. So yeah, I think that my advice will be in those lines, is that I won't fixate myself too much on these details, but if things are working very well and you can quantify how many clients you are referring to them,

[32:09] I will go into those details when you have the data. - All right. And our last question for Leo is, "How do you get a partnership going if someone has a partner covering that solution already? For example, our product is a website builder for fitness professionals, but a lot of potential larger partners have a web agency partnership already in place." So they're working with a consulting firm

[32:35] who's already basically doing that for them. "But I know our product would be way better their clients as well as the partner too. Do you try to muscle them out or just focus on building a relationship to start?" So it's an interesting question, right? There's almost like a gatekeeper, and those agencies are really good at building long-term relationships and good at enterprise sales

[32:57] or larger ticket consulting sales. So agencies may have 10, 20, 30 clients. And I think that the thought process here is do you go to each of those end clients and try to sell them on the solution that their agency is going to say, "Yeah, don't use that because that's essentially going to make them moot. Or do you go to the agency route and try to convince the agency, try to build something

[33:19] that they potentially need. It's a very specific question. So don't feel like you have to answer it in that context. But I think in general, what are your thoughts on there before we wrap? - Yeah. I think I never had to deal with agencies that represent some other solutions, but of course, I've been getting to the same place at which other law firms

[33:38] or alternative legal solutions we write. The only way that I was able to muscle out those competitors was of course, because there wasn't so many legal tech solutions, just because how it works on your pricing was from like 0.1, very effective, and second is that we were not only able, but we wanted to spend time understanding very clearly what was the problem that we're facing, each of these organizations,

[34:08] and then create a product that solves them. And of course, you can do this with everything, But at the beginning of the first couple of years made a lot of sense for us because we wanted to be the best ones dealing with tech companies in the country. And of course they were the main source not only of clients, but also information

[34:25] about why we need to build in order to solve these problems. And this, a lot of the little details about why they decided to go with Lexgo instead of the big law firms or some other cool alternative legal providers? Just because, I don't know, we spoke the same language. We understand the problems we're facing

[34:45] because we're also facing them ourselves. We were very transparent on the product we were building was to facilitate legal, not to be just this organization be another channel. We wanted to build a product that we know we could make more money offering legal advice on this, but we wanted to create your product just because we want everyone to have access to them. So we didn't choose this course or pitch just because we knew he was effective,

[35:11] we truly believed about that. And I know this is not like very concise advice about how to live with this, but I'm pretty sure that was the reason why we're so effective. Every time we do any kind of activity or building a specific product for them, like the portfolio founders and companies, they could relate to us in a way they couldn't

[35:33] with law firms. I think this is when you get a little more about branding and how your company brand talks to your users, et cetera. But I think that was one of the cool things we did from the beginning. For us, it wasn't a problem to close partnership because our founding team and the marketing were able to spend a lot of time just helping this very specific group of users, which sounds weird because you're focusing on a very small market,

[36:02] but you want them to love your solution. I think that's always very effective. - All right. Thank you so much, sir, for joining us today. If folks wanna keep up with you online, are you on Twitter? Where can they keep up with what you're up to? - Yeah. On Twitter, I think it's LeoBarrientosP.

[36:23] You can also get me on LinkedIn. I think it's a little easier. Please don't write me Leonardo. Leo's more than enough. Latin names can be difficult with their pronunciation. But your Spanish was pretty rough. Don't worry about that. (both laugh) - I think that's like five or six years of Spanish class in California schools.

[36:42] So I think it served me well. Awesome. Thanks again for joining me today, Leo. I appreciate it. - Was a pleasure meeting you all. Take care, guy. (upbeat 8-bit music)

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